robotwarsfandomcom-20200215-history
User talk:ToastUltimatum/Ragnabot Pt. II
IC overration I'm sorry, but there is no way that Infernal Contraption will ever beat Dominator 2. Jimlaad43(talk) 08:59, November 7, 2017 (UTC) :perhaps the Series 4 version. Toon Ganondorf (t ' 09:38, November 7, 2017 (UTC) ::Dominator II can't win just by surviving, it needs to attack, which will happen how? [[User:ToastUltimatum|'TOAS]][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|'T']] 10:17, November 7, 2017 (UTC) :::The problem with Infernal Contraption is that impacts tend to flip it on its own axle sonit faces the wrong way. It’s control has always been abysmal. Dominator 2 can hit Stinger so it is not implausible that it wins on aggression and definitely control. Toon Ganondorf (t ''' 10:24, November 7, 2017 (UTC) :Dominator 2 is one of the most accurate axes, and will easily hit Infernal Contraption. This also doesn't take into account the fact that IC is likely to just wobble itself into the pit anyway. IC won't damage Dominator ever. Jimlaad43(talk) 11:17, November 7, 2017 (UTC) ::It did that '''once in six fights. How is 16.67% "likely"? CrashBash (talk) 11:36, November 7, 2017 (UTC) :::I agree with Toast, Dominator is going to struggle getting a hit and though IC's damage won't be devastating, it's still damage and plus extra aggression for attempting to get hits.Diotoir the son of nemesis (talk) 15:43, November 7, 2017 (UTC) ::::Dominator 2's armour wouldn't even flinch from a hit from Infernal Contraption, and it can bundle the axlebot around the arena with its bi-wedge. Even something like Infinity that hardly has any attacking potential controlled proceedings against Infernal Contraption well enough. Nweston8 (talk) 17:28, November 7, 2017 (UTC) :Infernal Contraption is far too overrated on this wiki. It proved in every fight that it had no control and damage output was minimal. Dominator 2 on the other hand gets far too much underrating in battles that it gets treated like a round 1 dropout rather than the well armoured, well driven robot with a powerful and accurate axe that it actually has. None of the arguments presented make sense for IC to win.--Jimlaad43(talk) 16:41, November 9, 2017 (UTC) ::In its time, Infernal Contraption's drum has thrown CV into the air, twisted the chassis of Bulldog Breed by over 10mm, damaged Eruption's RAEX armour, and immobilised Turbulence. Dominator II has a broad surface, a terrible track record against spinners, and armour which naturally generates sparks upon impact, which would create the illusion of damage from Infernal Contraption even if none were caused. Infernal Contraption's weapon will cause more than Dominator II's frontal charges could ever do, and the decision stands. [[User:ToastUltimatum|'T'OAS]][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|'T']] 16:53, November 9, 2017 (UTC) :::Not disputing that IC's drum is a good weapon, it's got decent power behind it, it's just using it. It's the fact that because it's effectively torque reaction it has to drive away from an opponent to bring it into play, so most of the time it's going to get glancing blows, and on average half the time it'll be spinning downwards, so it'll just throw itself away. (also I still maintain that IC twisted BB's chassis mainly by landing on it). Combatwombat555 (talk) 18:04, November 9, 2017 (UTC) ::::IC may have caused that damage, but what did it do? It lost. IC had 4 series t prove itself and never did, while Dominator 2 performed exceptionally in all 5 series it appeared in, even when it lost. IC never had the power to cause anywhere near the damage required to immobilise Dominator 2. A few good pushes from Dominator will score a lot more points than flailing about aimlessly. Jimlaad43(talk) 18:09, November 9, 2017 (UTC) Opinions so far Scraptosaur and Arena Cleaner to win those fights you've not decided. Very bold of you to knock out Dominator 2 and Eruption, but I'm not complaining. As the singular voter in favour of The General vs Bonk in Ragnabot 2, you don't have to follow such convincing results if you're thinking otherwise. It's your tournament after all :P. I'm waiting for my Ragnabot until Series 10 has totally finished, but I'll enjoy following yours all the same. [[User:The R A Z 3R|'R'a'z'3'r']](talk) 15:40, November 7, 2017 (UTC) :I'm in the same boat as you there. There's something I know I want to do, but I need to make sure Series 10 is well and truly done. CrashBash (talk) 15:43, November 7, 2017 (UTC) ::Thanks for the Scraptosaur vote, I'm inclined to agree. That said, I won't be confirming Arena Cleaner vs Kadeena Machina for a few weeks, even if I do currently favour Arena Cleaner. [[User:ToastUltimatum|'T'OAS]][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|'T']] 16:01, November 7, 2017 (UTC) Provided it works properly, Gyrobot should beat RoTaS easily. As for The Grim Reaper vs Pussycat, I'd back The Grim Reaper. Pussycat struggled when it couldn't KO flipper opponents, deservingly losing to Chaos 2, Firestorm, Bulldog Breed and M2, not to mention being dominated by Dantomkia before that KO. Of all of these flippers, The Grim Reaper is the most reliable. It'll get plenty of flips in, has lots of gas, is nippy and pretty well armoured. If Pussycat can't knock it out, I see The Grim Reaper getting most of the aggression and control points. Clearly, you thought they'd stand up to Hypno-Disc well enough, and it can do so against Pussycat too in my opinion. [[User:The R A Z 3R|'R'a'z'3'r']](talk) 08:05, November 8, 2017 (UTC) Thoughts on various battles I believe Gyrobot should win a close encounter here. I personally believe that with generally better armour, as well as its opponent having an unreliable petrol engine, Gyrobot will be able to tank the blows for longer, and cause a knockout. SpaceManiac888 (Talk) 16:50, November 7, 2017 (UTC) :I am glad someone does believe Vector could have been a decent Series 3 robot. That said, I also find writing it off on the basis that "it never moved" to be a tad unfair, as it appeared it suffered an unfortunate fire prior to the battle (hence the smoke). I am sure such a malfunction cannot occur everytime Vector is placed in a battle, otherwise you may as well vote against Plunderstorm in every battle, despite it technically being an upgrade over Plunderbird 2. With that said, I actually think Vector could beat Tantrum, avenging its loss over T2, the sequel. SpaceManiac888 (Talk) 21:42, November 8, 2017 (UTC) ::I think that's fair enough, I'll give Vector the win on the next update. Luckily I've never had to work with Plunderstorm in a tournament before. I can't see Gyrobot earning a knockout, but breaking the flipper of ROT&S is a possibility, either way that heat can't be finished for a few weeks. [[User:ToastUltimatum|'T'OAS]][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|'T']] 16:31, November 9, 2017 (UTC) :::Thanks for the change. Anyhow, as for the Beast/Slicer battle, I actually think the Dutch Series 1 champion will win this. Although Beast is a decent live event flipper, the problem is that it was pretty much designed for live events, which lack deadly spinners. Because of this, Beast's internals, especially at the sides, are heavily exposed to the elements, enabling Slicer's decent drum to cause enough damage for a knockout. SpaceManiac888 (Talk) 07:54, November 10, 2017 (UTC) Androne 4000/Tut Tut vs Storm 2 Personally if I were to vote, Storm 2 has this easy it has the rambot will be able to ram and control Androne/Tut Tut. Honestly I don't see why people think Androne 4000 is going to be good, it looks flimsy and the claw won't grab anything in my eyes.Diotoir the son of nemesis (talk) 11:29, November 10, 2017 (UTC) :There's no point in trying to decide ahead of time when Androne's episode airs in just two days. You never know, it could surprise us all. Similarly, I COULD decide Nuts 2 vs Gravity based on Series 9, but when it has another episode in two days time, why not wait? Based on a first glance at Androne 4000, I would also agree that Storm2 would win the match, but you have to remember that I've already seen every Series 10 competitor fight at least once when I went to filming, so I don't want to give away any potential opinions I may currently have. :Side note though, thanks for engaging with this everybody, I certainly ran this Ragnabot for myself more than for readership, but it's a pleasant surprise that people have followed along. [[User:ToastUltimatum|'T'OAS]][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|'T']] 16:47, November 10, 2017 (UTC) ::Ah didn't realise we weren't allowed to vote ahead of time :P Well I'll stay with my decision and will have a change of mind when the episode airs...that is if I have a change of mind.Diotoir the son of nemesis (talk) 17:54, November 10, 2017 (UTC) :::UPDATE: I still think Storm 2 will win easily. Androne 4000 was still surprisingly impressive nonetheless I must say. Diotoir the son of nemesis (talk) 13:01, November 13, 2017 (UTC) S9 qualify Steg and Splinter. Jimlaad43(talk) 08:45, January 31, 2018 (UTC) :Hypno, because it was slightly less unreliable. Revolution 2 because it does at least give out big hits, and should last a little longer before falling apart. Remember it was better in Extreme 2 than Series 6. (That's a sweeping statement, not just a message aimed at you Toast). My opinions on the two qualifiers still hasn't changed. Jimlaad43(talk) 20:44, February 1, 2018 (UTC) *'Steg' - The Termite seemed really quite slow around the arena, and I'm not convinced by how damaging the cutters/drum thing is. Steg's front armour was decent, it should withstand it and bully its way to a win. *'Slicer' - I just struggle to see what Splinter can do. Front-on it'll be axe-shaft vs drum and Slicer is likely to have the advantage with pushing power; Slicer's too long to hug side-on; and the rear's a ground-scraping wedge, nothing to grab there. Slicer's drum should do the business if it gets side-on to Splinter, possibly toss it over, probably break an arm. *'Revolution 2' - Likewise, there's nothing SoK can do here, the tiny flipper won't overturn the massive Revolution 2, and any blows it takes will likely do a fair amount of damage, given it's only armoured in road signs. *'Fluffy' - Blimey, doozy of a fight. Hypno-Disc is the more reliable machine, but with two massive horizontal weapons it's a weapon-on-weapon clash that is most likely to happen, and Fluffy's blade is more powerful- similar weight but spins twice as fast, and a bar stores more energy than a disc- plus there's a chance that the blade strikes the flat side of the disc rather than an impactor. If that happens, provided Fluffy can survive its own recoil, it should immobilise Hypno-Disc for the win. Combatwombat555 (talk) 21:35, February 1, 2018 (UTC) Heat I Decisions I'd personally go with Push to Exit, provided it doesn't break down, Iron-Awe 2.1 due to having a more powerful flipper, and the fact it doesn't have to fully get underneath for an effective flip, and Foxic because it'll be too agile and slippery for Suicidal Tendencies to get a grip. [[User:The R A Z 3R|'R'a'z'3'r']](talk)< *'S.M.I.D.S.Y.' - Push to Exit is lower on a head-to-head drive, and in that case the flipper's narrow enough that S.M.I.D.S.Y. should get beached for an easy flip- but then what? S.M.I.D.S.Y.'s not going to get knocked out by a flip, it's nimble enough that Push to Exit won't get many flips in especially seeing as it has to get S.M.I.D.S.Y. right up the wedge for a good flip, and Push to Exit's long sides look easy to exploit with shoves and lifts. Plus Push to Exit's not the most reliable machine in the world. *'Iron-Awe 2.1' - I still doubt Iron-Awe's ability to self-right, but Mute didn't actually manage to overturn many opponents, I'll give Iron-Awe the benefit of the doubt. Not sure Iron-Awe's flipper is more powerful, but it's easier to get a decent flip in with. Plus that axe should do some fairly severe damage to Mute's top. *'Foxic' - Even if the lifter fails to work, Foxic should dominate. Suicidal Tendencies will really struggle to get a grip on such a nippy, low machine. Seeing as you asked (kinda), I'd also disagree with your earlier call to put Gravity through over Rapid. The Series 10 Rapid had a lower flipper blade that did seem flush to the ground instead of just the flanges, and Gravity tended to rear up on a drive anyway. Combatwombat555 (talk) 21:45, February 6, 2018 (UTC) :Nweston8 also disagreed with my Gravity vote so it might be worth changing it, on the condition that Behemoth keeps its heat win regardless. Also, um, I counter-vote Mute!! [[User:ToastUltimatum|'T'OAS]][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|'T']] 22:56, February 6, 2018 (UTC) :: ::*'S.M.I.D.S.Y.' - An ineffective performance from both before Push to Exit's reliability problems hinder it - whether that be with it fully breaking down or allowing S.M.I.D.S.Y. to get effective drives in. ::*'Iron-Awe 2.1' - Iron-Awe 2.1 is an awkward machine to shovel upwards anyhow, and that'll especially prove to be the case with Mute's steep flipper. Also, Iron-Awe 2.1 will catch Mute side on when Mute itself attempts to get to Iron-Awe 2.1's flanks. Nweston8 (talk) 23:40, February 6, 2018 (UTC) :::SMIDSY Iron Awe and Foxic Jimlaad43(talk) 23:41, February 6, 2018 (UTC) Opinion on Frostbite-Barber-Ous and vote on Nuts 2-Tetanus Booster I have seen your decision on the Frostbite-Barber-Ous battle, and in my opinion, it makes absolute... sense. That's right, I actually agree with it. The thing is, I am probably one of the few people that actually thinks Frostbite is underrated, as its design is rather genius against a robot like Barber-Ous. Indeed, although Barber-Ous is capable of causing massive amounts of damage, it needs to do this before its opponent can score a good hit on it with a great weapon. Hypno-Disc proved this, Terrorhurtz did... and so will Frostbite in my opinion, since its empty space should generally enable it to absorb some blows (Barber-Ous' drum is not as powerful as Supernova's disc), whilst eventually scoring a winning hit on one of the wheels with its decent enough bar spinner (which is better than Shredder Evolution's discs). It is funny; I think Barber-Ous can beat Firestorm 4/5, but lose to Frostbite. In addition, I would go as far as to say that you should have put Frostbite over St. Agro in your previous Ragnabot tournament. As for the Nuts 2-Tetanus Booster battle, an easy victory for Nuts 2 in my opinion. Tetanus Booster's internals I believe might be too unreliable to sustain constant blows, especially since they almost failed near the end against Ewe 2. SpaceManiac888 (Talk) 18:23, February 9, 2018 (UTC) :After seeing over 1,400 characters of text starting with "Opinion on Frostbite-Barber-Ous" I was bracing myself for the worst, well played sir. Have you got a view on Stinger vs Wolverine? [[User:ToastUltimatum|'T'OAS]][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|'T']] 18:30, February 9, 2018 (UTC) *'Barber-Ous' - I'll give Barber-Ous the benefit here. It still is explosive enough to shatter a machine. Understand the idea behind it losing though. *'Nuts 2' - Cool idea, but Tetanus Booster probably won't take a hit well wherever the contact is. Those tyres are in big danger. *'Wolverine' - Stinger to be comfortably bullied around the arena by the chunky, aggressive Wolverine. Think a Steel Avenger-esque performance (I can't believe I'm crediting Steel Avenger). Nweston8 (talk) 21:28, February 9, 2018 (UTC) M2 vs Drillzilla I could definitely do with some help on this one, it's a very hard decision on top of my plentiful M2 bias. Opinions on Dominator II vs X-Terminator from Series 7 would also be great (and does anybody think Manta could've reached the Top 64 and prevented Dominator from being in this position to begin with?) [[User:ToastUltimatum|'T'OAS]][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|'T']] 21:19, February 19, 2018 (UTC) :I don't want to have to burst the bubble, but I think Drillzilla has this pretty easily. I don't think M2 will be powerful enough to flip over the walker, and Drillzilla will push M2 around the arena until it's either pitted or time runs out. M2 won't win on damage, nor do I think it would win on control (it did miss a few flips in some of its fights) or aggression. As for Dominator 2 vs X-Terminator, I'd back X-Terminator myself. Despite its slow speed, it still proved itself to be pretty maneuvreable, and I think it can get the disc in and trouble the wheel guards. It'll also have the advantage in pushing power, and won't suffer from Dominator 2's hits. The armour seemed good enough, and the bulk means that the hits won't trouble internals either. [[User:The R A Z 3R|'R'a'z'3'r']](talk) 22:06, February 19, 2018 (UTC) For me it's down to whether Drillzilla can actually run inverted or not. I've been back and forth on this a lot, but honestly I don't think it can- looking at pictures from the front or rear, it's clear that the banks of legs stretch all the way along Drillzilla's length, which they don't on the top. If M2 does manage to get a flip in, and I think it has the power to, it'll just wiggle slightly like a dying fly. Agree with Raz3r with Dominator 2/X-Terminator though. As to whether Dominator 2 should even be here... I honestly don't know. Some fights Manta absolutely dominated, zipping around the arena, bullying opponents, and that Manta I think would win. Dominator 2 didn't like fighting Tornado and Manta's evil little blade should knock it upwards and enable Manta to push it around fairly easily, possibly snagging a wheels. Other fights, though, Manta seemed to really become really sluggish not too far into the fight and not manage to push opponents around in the way you'd expect- that Manta would get axed repeatedly and probably lose on aggression. Combatwombat555 (talk) 22:36, February 19, 2018 (UTC) :I have always operated under the belief that Drillzilla is not invertible. Likewise I give Manta benefit of the doubt on battery life, as these are three minute fights rather than five; the battle against Rocky-Bot-Boa, for example, went the distance. [[User:ToastUltimatum|'T'OAS]][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|'T']] 23:17, February 19, 2018 (UTC) ::In which case, M2 and Manta. Combatwombat555 (talk) 23:26, February 19, 2018 (UTC) Qualifier assistance The newest batch of qualifiers had some troubling battles, would value some opinions on: *Tsunami (S7) vs Shockwave (S8) - Two Discord votes for Tsunami, I think I agree, last chance to save Shockwave! *THE BASH vs Shell Shock - leaning towards Shell Shock *Frostbite vs Daisy-Cutter - one Discord vote for Daisy-Cutter *Panzer Mk II vs Or Te - one Discord vote for Panzer Mk II, I'm leaning towards Or Te *Vulture vs Cherub *The Revolutionist vs Crackers 'n' Smash *Eric vs AJjay *Crank-E vs PulverizeR *Cedric Slammer vs Ansgar 3 *101 vs Piranha - I see a case for Piranha although 101 is probably safer [[User:ToastUltimatum|'T'OAS]][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|'T']] 16:39, March 27, 2018 (UTC) Shockwave, either version of Shell Shock, Daisy Cutter, Panzer, Vulture, Revolutionist, Eric, Crank-E, Ansgar, 101. Jimlaad43(talk) 17:19, March 27, 2018 (UTC) :*'Shockwave' - Very tight, but whilst Tsunami has the incredibly powerful flipper it has to finish it quickly, and I'm not convinced it'll be able to throw Shockwave OotA. Shockwave to tip it over once the gas starts running low. :*'THE BASH' - Whilst there's nothing really for THE BASH's jaw to grab hold of- well, maybe Shell Shock's rear disc- those pneumatic spikes could see some use, and it did look fairly nippy around the arena in the 5 seconds we saw of it before it died. Shell Shock was ponderous, and the axe almost looked gravity-powered and would be unlikely to do any damage to THE BASH whatsoever. THE BASH to show more aggression and take the decision, or guide Shell Shock to the flipper. :*'Daisy-Cutter' - Frostbite's shattering armour seems a very vulnerable to a decent spinner like Daisy-Cutter. It's not Supernova-standard, but a few good hits should do it. :*'Or Te' - It's just down to whether Or Te loses the link in the first impact or not- and given it survived a good while against Apollo in the same year, I'll give it the benefit of the doubt. One flip should win it. :*'Cherub' - Cherub was decently aggressive and should be able to get underneath Vulture and bully it for the win. Can't see Vulture's weapon having much impact at all. :*'The Revolutionist' - Neither will take much damage, but The Revolutionist's attacks will count a lot more than whatever Crackers or Smash can do. :*'Eric' - I back Eric to get a flip in. :*'Crank-E' - Providing it stays facing PulverizeR, Crank-E's front shield should take whatever PulverizeR can throw at it, and dish out some reasonable damage in return. :*'Ansgar 3' - Ansgar's heavy armour should comfortably stand up to Cedric's disc, and enough slams to the side should take a wheel. :*'101' - Piranha may land the odd hit with the blade but 101 will bully it to victory. Combatwombat555 (talk) 17:36, March 27, 2018 (UTC) Heat Final random musings *'Panzer Mk4 ' vs Hydra. Hydra seemed to struggle dodging well driven and fast robots. Hydra to be pitted. *'Atomic' vs Shockwave. Who says OotA's are off the menu? Atomic was a decent pusher, and Thor showed that Shockwave could be outpushed. Atomic can easily get Shockwave out if/when it gets near the edges. Otherwise, it can flip all day and take it on a judges decision. Jimlaad43(talk) 14:44, April 3, 2018 (UTC) :*'Atomic' vs Shockwave (S8) – Very close call. Both machines have very effective wedges, but I’d say that Atomic would be likely to exploit Shockwave’s ground clearance more often and chuck it around. It’s not to say that Shockwave won’t try and flip Atomic over, or ram it into the walls/House Robots, but Atomic’s flips should give it the Judges’ nod on aggression. :*'Panzer Mk 4' vs Hydra – Same as Jimlaad’s reasoning, but I’d also like to point out that Hydra’s ground clearance in its Series 7 form was already vulnerable against wedges to begin with, so will most likely be exploited from the outset by Panzer Mk 4's revised scoop. In spite of its own ground clearance and lack of srimech, Panzer Mk 4 should have no problems dodging that arm and ramming Hydra into oblivion. [[User:VulcansHowl|'Vulcans']][[User talk:VulcansHowl|'Howl']] 15:35, April 3, 2018 (UTC) *'Hydra' - Panzer has a lot of power, but Hydra's no slouch either. It could be pitted, but what's the chance the pit actually gets into play? And if it doesn't, Panzer's not going to able to finish Hydra off. Over the course of the fight, Hydra should be able to exploit Panzer's own high ground clearance and get at least one flip in. I genuinely can't call the other fight. If anything I'd lean towards Shockwave, but that's probably mainly because it hasn't been voted for yet rather than for any concrete reason. Combatwombat555 (talk) 17:23, April 3, 2018 (UTC) Why is Medusa Oblongatta in Heat P twice, spelled differently too. Also, you have grossly overestimated Vulture there. The wedge isn't the same one Apex used, and only operates at the front. The wheels are also very vulnerable and will be torn apart. The weapon on Vulture will not do anything, or will be shredded when it makes contact with Carbide's blade. When Carbide hits the wedge of Vulture, it will be thrown up. However, if it is thrown up, the angle will draw it further towards Vulture, causing major damage to the weapon on the top. This is a nonsensical decision used to remove Carbide rather than go with what would happen. Jimlaad43(talk) 22:58, April 4, 2018 (UTC) :There were two very different versions of Medusa Oblongata/Oblongotta. I can see the logic for Vulture/Carbide, but ultimately all Vulture can do is survive- and, considering how easy it was to lock Vulture's wheels up on one side, if/when Carbide gets to Vulture's rear or sides it's game. Does make the tournament a bit more interesting though. Combatwombat555 (talk) 23:08, April 4, 2018 (UTC) ::I get the idea of thinking Carbide would win, absolutely - but I don't understand what you're trying to tell me about Vulture's scoop. It had two, the one in the official photos, and the one borrowed by Track-tion, which Vulture itself used in its Group Battle. Obviously they would use that. I did start writing it up as a Carbide win but the final description basically turned out as "I think Vulture would win but I can't prove it so Carbide moves on". Medusa was completely intentional but I have it that description to play up to the joke. [[User:ToastUltimatum|'T'OAS]][[User talk:ToastUltimatum|'T']] 23:14, April 4, 2018 (UTC) :::I have to applaud you for the sheer audacity of voting Vulture over Carbide. That's just so unashamedly transparent it's noble. 'Toon Ganondorf (t ' 11:00, April 5, 2018 (UTC) Revolution 2 Joke Good joke!! Adster1005 (talk) 23:43, January 18, 2019 (UTC)